random thoughts?

[Karine]

Here's my "sad/angry moment"

I wish there were more active members in this forum, because we would have great discussions about the songs and what they mean to us. Sometimes I feel like it's just a News board, used to announce activities but without deep interactions between members.
I know that some people come and read the topics, I see it in the view stats, but they don't participate or maybe they're not even members. For example, Ellen opened a new section for "Shine On" and it has already 13 views. Who are these 13 people?
The Twitter account for "Solaced.Info" has 121 followers: what should we do to make them want to come here?
A contest featuring goodies we collected over the years? A "welcome pack" with some fun surprises?

Ok, it's the end of my sad/angry moment. I don't want to repel them with this post

[Ellie]

Karine, you're right and it's something I've been struggling with as well. Though I know I'm not the most active around this forum as well (but I'm changing that!) I know what you mean. I guess it also has to do with the fact that Sarah is really using now the social media to keep her fans in the loop. This causes for me to be the last with news/updates (though the rare stuff leaks of course first to us, things Sarah doesn't share but eventually pop up anyway like the Audi video) and I can understand that people rather interact with Sarah/follow her twitter account than Solaced's for example. I guess that results in people just viewing the site and leaving no comments. As for the members just viewing, I guess it are also just bots checking the forum or guests who happened to stumble upon the new subforum for example.

As for all the followers on Solaced's twitter - a great part has signed up on the forum, but never post I guess. I think they just read the news and that's it.

[Karine]

Karine, you're right and it's something I've been struggling with as well. Though I know I'm not the most active around this forum as well (but I'm changing that!) I know what you mean. I guess it also has to do with the fact that Sarah is really using now the social media to keep her fans in the loop. This causes for me to be the last with news/updates (though the rare stuff leaks of course first to us, things Sarah doesn't share but eventually pop up anyway like the Audi video) and I can understand that people rather interact with Sarah/follow her twitter account than Solaced's for example. I guess that results in people just viewing the site and leaving no comments. As for the members just viewing, I guess it are also just bots checking the forum or guests who happened to stumble upon the new subforum for example.

As for all the followers on Solaced's twitter - a great part has signed up on the forum, but never post I guess. I think they just read the news and that's it.

I see the hard work you do with the website (gallery and media updates, news, tour archives, ...) and I'm like: Why? Why???
At the same time, I understand what you mean. Take my sister, for example: she was a member of the Blackened-Sky boards, but when I told her that you opened your own forum, she just wasn't interested in it anymore. She talks with me about the music, but she doesn't have/take the time to register here. It's exactly what you wrote: she follows the official Fb and Twitter accounts and it's enough for her. She doesn't care about the rare 1994 picture you could find or the last charity event Sarah went to.

I can spend an hour just looking for pictures or things like that, so it makes me a little bit sad when no one seems to enjoy the discoveries as much as I do.
Sometimes, I want to be an evil fan, that posts all the good stuff only in the Multimedia section, restricted to members!
Well, I suppose that by doing this, it would have the opposite effect: people who stumble accross the forum for the first time would believe that nothing is going on here.

[Ellie]

I see the hard work you do with the website (gallery and media updates, news, tour archives, ...) and I'm like: Why? Why???
At the same time, I understand what you mean. Take my sister, for example: she was a member of the Blackened-Sky boards, but when I told her that you opened your own forum, she just wasn't interested in it anymore. She talks with me about the music, but she doesn't have/take the time to register here. It's exactly what you wrote: she follows the official Fb and Twitter accounts and it's enough for her. She doesn't care about the rare 1994 picture you could find or the last charity event Sarah went to.

I can spend an hour just looking for pictures or things like that, so it makes me a little bit sad when no one seems to enjoy the discoveries as much as I do.
Sometimes, I want to be an evil fan, that posts all the good stuff only in the Multimedia section, restricted to members!
Well, I suppose that by doing this, it would have the opposite effect: people who stumble accross the forum for the first time would believe that nothing is going on here.

Well you know, though it's hard work and it doesn't always pay off, there's no way I'll stop all the Solaced work. I understand what you mean, about the discoveries, there are some dates/venues in the tour archive of which I have no information, and I keep on looking and looking until I finally find it (or something completely new). And I guess alot of people think about it the same way your sister does - which is in no way bad or anything, I understand it. I guess for that reason this forum and Solaced itself is much more a source/connection for the somewhat die-hard fans maybe. Having that said, I still get alot of email of people who visited the site and are asking for bootlegs. That's one thing that will never die I guess Oh and also, the Lufthansa article already got 24 downloads, so that's something. But it's the same thing as you realized with the forums: I see people visiting the site (through the stats, I can even see what search string they used in Google when they clicked on Solaced) and downloading LOTS of stuff but never really comment or sign up on the forum. It was also one of the reasons to create the Christmas guestbook and the Christmas presents - the presents got downloaded sooo much but I never received the same amount of comments.

Putting all the files in the multimedia section would help, maybe, but yes I think people would guess the forum would be dead then I'm not sure there's much we can do, besides just keeping everything alive right here. So yeah, I guess where Sarah's official FB/Twitter/site is all fancy-up to date and fast, I guess we're also some kind of archive that they don't provide. And that's good enough for me OK, that was my rambling

[CarolCiola]

I see the hard work you do with the website (gallery and media updates, news, tour archives, ...) and I'm like: Why? Why???
At the same time, I understand what you mean. Take my sister, for example: she was a member of the Blackened-Sky boards, but when I told her that you opened your own forum, she just wasn't interested in it anymore. She talks with me about the music, but she doesn't have/take the time to register here. It's exactly what you wrote: she follows the official Fb and Twitter accounts and it's enough for her. She doesn't care about the rare 1994 picture you could find or the last charity event Sarah went to.

I can spend an hour just looking for pictures or things like that, so it makes me a little bit sad when no one seems to enjoy the discoveries as much as I do.
Sometimes, I want to be an evil fan, that posts all the good stuff only in the Multimedia section, restricted to members!
Well, I suppose that by doing this, it would have the opposite effect: people who stumble accross the forum for the first time would believe that nothing is going on here.

Well you know, though it's hard work and it doesn't always pay off, there's no way I'll stop all the Solaced work. I understand what you mean, about the discoveries, there are some dates/venues in the tour archive of which I have no information, and I keep on looking and looking until I finally find it (or something completely new). And I guess alot of people think about it the same way your sister does - which is in no way bad or anything, I understand it. I guess for that reason this forum and Solaced itself is much more a source/connection for the somewhat die-hard fans maybe. Having that said, I still get alot of email of people who visited the site and are asking for bootlegs. That's one thing that will never die I guess Oh and also, the Lufthansa article already got 24 downloads, so that's something. But it's the same thing as you realized with the forums: I see people visiting the site (through the stats, I can even see what search string they used in Google when they clicked on Solaced) and downloading LOTS of stuff but never really comment or sign up on the forum. It was also one of the reasons to create the Christmas guestbook and the Christmas presents - the presents got downloaded sooo much but I never received the same amount of comments.

Putting all the files in the multimedia section would help, maybe, but yes I think people would guess the forum would be dead then I'm not sure there's much we can do, besides just keeping everything alive right here. So yeah, I guess where Sarah's official FB/Twitter/site is all fancy-up to date and fast, I guess we're also some kind of archive that they don't provide. And that's good enough for me OK, that was my rambling

As I read your post, Karine, I took a bit of your pain, too. I feel the same with my fan site and Facebook page. I never made nothing about any artist, and didn't know what to expect about people's return. I see that people access the fan site but do not interact in any way. Facebook is a little bit worse, because of the 59 enjoys we have at this moment, only 4 or 5 people like or comment the posts. And it discourages a lot, really. It's laborious to search content, even for the Facebook posts (at least, I try to delve a bit on the topic of the post before posting something). I see that people read, but it stops there.

I thought several times if continue this work in Brazil worth it, because of the culture around here about music (they are very closed to national music and hits of the moment).

Nowadays, social networks are actually making unofficial websites about the artists become true "media and rare materials archives", as Ellen said. People mostly want the content, and that's it. It's amazing we are on a www and don't have a return of this type. But I honestly think that social networks, even allowing quick access to new releases, will never replace the role of sites.

It makes me happy to continue this work of sharing Sarah's contents because it's more like a personal thing, I mean, I started to do it for myself at the beggining, and when at least one person likes it, it makes me feel good for keep it moving. And one of the greatest motivations I have is this forum's support Don't give up, girls!

[Ellie]

As I read your post, Karine, I took a bit of your pain, too. I feel the same with my fan site and Facebook page. I never made nothing about any artist, and didn't know what to expect about people's return. I see that people access the fan site but do not interact in any way. Facebook is a little bit worse, because of the 59 enjoys we have at this moment, only 4 or 5 people like or comment the posts. And it discourages a lot, really. It's laborious to search content, even for the Facebook posts (at least, I try to delve a bit on the topic of the post before posting something). I see that people read, but it stops there.

I thought several times if continue this work in Brazil worth it, because of the culture around here about music (they are very closed to national music and hits of the moment).

Nowadays, social networks are actually making unofficial websites about the artists become true "media and rare materials archives", as Ellen said. People mostly want the content, and that's it. It's amazing we are on a www and don't have a return of this type. But I honestly think that social networks, even allowing quick access to new releases, will never replace the role of sites.

It makes me happy to continue this work of sharing Sarah's contents because it's more like a personal thing, I mean, I started to do it for myself at the beggining, and when at least one person likes it, it makes me feel good for keep it moving. And one of the greatest motivations I have is this forum's support Don't give up, girls!

Solaced started for me as a personal thing as well. As you can read under the About Us page, I found so many mini-fansites on free website-build-things, all from 1999-2000 and sometimes earlier. I guess those people stopped being interested in the Sarah-news or anything else related as well. I guess that's how it all started, to make one big archive. To be honest, I still find some hidden small fansites which feature information about bootlegs of which I had no idea!

But yes, it's discouraging - a lot. But it does help to know there's this central core of Sarah fans - most of which are on this forum - who still appreciate this all. I guess if it wasn't for you guys and the fact that I love to do Sarah research (it reached even a point that I think my family thinks I'm crazy.. they don't count it as *real* work But I do! haha) I would've let the site down. I mean, I think I understand why Witchy did that after all - besides all the hard work and not having much time, it costs alot of money as well for me each year. But knowing the site functions as an archive and still converts some new fans - yes I mean you Ed! - it does make it all worth it. And no, I won't give up

PS. - I should actually just be shamelessly promoting myself just everywhere up to a point that I'm just spamming fans. But I guess that would cause them to run away from me haha

[CarolCiola]

Ellie, I think that this is the greatest point of all this thing: we HAVE to be this kind of "crazy" ! You don't make something like this if you don't be crazy enough, (you work with Informatics too, dont't you? You know what I mean ).

And it IS considered a work, why not? It envolves much dedication, time, patience, exaustion... in my case it doesn't involves money (yet), but soon it will. You have to be this crazy for the commitment. For instance, after all my day, most of times I spend part of the night connected waiting for some news warned earlier by Sarah's Team, that's because we have 6 hours of difference about the time zone.

I just keep thinking if most of this hidden fan pages stopped because of this non returning.. it's sad =/

[Ellie]

Ellie, I think that this is the greatest point of all this thing: we HAVE to be this kind of "crazy" ! You don't make something like this if you don't be crazy enough, (you work with Informatics too, dont't you? You know what I mean ).

And it IS considered a work, why not? It envolves much dedication, time, patience, exaustion... in my case it doesn't involves money (yet), but soon it will. You have to be this crazy for the commitment. For instance, after all my day, most of times I spend part of the night connected waiting for some news warned earlier by Sarah's Team, that's because we have 6 hours of difference about the time zone.

I just keep thinking if most of this hidden fan pages stopped because of this non returning.. it's sad =/

Yes, I think we are a little bit crazy And yeah, I work somewhat with informatics though - it's not my study or job, but I taught myself everything while working on the site, but I know what you mean

It's indeed sad about the hidden, small fan pages. A great deal of them are offline because the free-web service has stopped (like geocities I believe) but I was able to probably get 90% of all info from those site before they were gone.... I even remember I had this great site with basically ALL of Sarah's tour dates - which luckily I copied before it went down. I guess that just how things go... I think I remember even asking Witchy for the content of B-S.net, since I have the feeling there was a lot more in that gallery that I currently have, before she shut it down.. Not sure if I really ever got a reply, but I managed to get for example all the articles she ever put online.

[Karine]

It's funny how we all feel the same!
About the websites that were created around the release of Surfacing, there's also one thing we have to remember: the age of their webmasters. Those who were 25 at that time are 40 now, they work and many of them have kids.
I see it with my sister: she had her first job as a teacher this year and she is way more busy then when she was a student. When I do have a job and (I hope!) kids, I'm not sure I'll have the same amount of time to look for "Sarah stuff" on the web.
Besides my "regular" work (my thesis), I also have a website, not related to music, it's about a traditional canadian craftwork. I understand what you mean Ellen, because it costs me more than 100$/year just for the domain registration and the webhosting plan. The stats are quite low (between 1000-2000 pages viewed per month), but it's the only website like this in Canada, so the official tourist site of the government of Québec posted a link to it on its French and English Twitter accounts.
It's exactly what you describe: I do it because I like it, not to get any reward for it (though I was proud when I saw that the government official promoted it).

Do you know why I save every promo picture of Sarah I can find (and some live pics too, only the beautiful one)?
I imagine that in the future, in my future big house (ahah!), I'll have a room dedicated to music, with all my CDs, with confortable chairs where I will sit to read while I listen to music. There'll be posters on every wall of my big music room and Sarah will be the queen of it!
(Pffff... I'm sure I'll live in a tiny little appartment and all the promo pics of Sarah will remain in my computer )!

By the way, Ellen, in the past, I saved almost all of the pictures that were in Witchy's galleries. I didn't keep everything: some live pictures or magazine scans were really bad and I deleted them. I kept all the promo pics, artworks, etc. If you want, when I'll have the time to do it (later in the year), I could make screencaps of my files and you could see if there are photos that you don't have. You could add them to the gallery.

[Islandflyer]

It's funny how we all feel the same!
About the websites that were created around the release of Surfacing, there's also one thing we have to remember: the age of their webmasters. Those who were 25 at that time are 40 now, they work and many of them have kids.
I see it with my sister: she had her first job as a teacher this year and she is way more busy then when she was a student. When I do have a job and (I hope!) kids, I'm not sure I'll have the same amount of time to look for "Sarah stuff" on the web.
Besides my "regular" work (my thesis), I also have a website, not related to music, it's about a traditional canadian craftwork. I understand what you mean Ellen, because it costs me more than 100$/year just for the domain registration and the webhosting plan. The stats are quite low (between 1000-2000 pages viewed per month), but it's the only website like this in Canada, so the official tourist site of the government of Québec posted a link to it on its French and English Twitter accounts.
It's exactly what you describe: I do it because I like it, not to get any reward for it (though I was proud when I saw that the government official promoted it).

Do you know why I save every promo picture of Sarah I can find (and some live pics too, only the beautiful one)?
I imagine that in the future, in my future big house (ahah!), I'll have a room dedicated to music, with all my CDs, with confortable chairs where I will sit to read while I listen to music. There'll be posters on every wall of my big music room and Sarah will be the queen of it!
(Pffff... I'm sure I'll live in a tiny little appartment and all the promo pics of Sarah will remain in my computer )!

By the way, Ellen, in the past, I saved almost all of the pictures that were in Witchy's galleries. I didn't keep everything: some live pictures or magazine scans were really bad and I deleted them. I kept all the promo pics, artworks, etc. If you want, when I'll have the time to do it (later in the year), I could make screencaps of my files and you could see if there are photos that you don't have. You could add them to the gallery.

I just noticed this thread, Ellen, not having been paying attention. I have wondered about the lack of more substantial discussion of the music, and I had hoped to get some comments about the various shows I asked Ellen for, by posting a short review. I see they have been "viewed" but no-one has commented. Does that mean no-one is interested in this history, or that no-one else is downloading and listening? So I'm wondering, since I missed this entire thread until today, if there is a way to highlight new threads and posts more dramatically, perhaps?

I look at the latest posts when I check the site, but I see I'm missing earlier ones I didn't realize were there. Thanks for pointing me to this, Ellen. You have all been discussing what I was wondering about, and I'm being guilty of not noticing like "the lurkers" are. Ellen has done such a great job of assembling all this material, it's a shame there are fewer taking advantage of it. Having finally started paying attention to Sarah's music about a year ago, this has been an invaluable resource to learn about it. You've been a great help, too, Karine. And I bet you will have that big house! Of course, it might be hard to find a CD player that still works, but..... (antique store, maybe )

So before I got into Sarah's music I was a "diehard" fan of Suzanne Vega, who has a lot of similar music, in some ways, to Sarah's. She had a long-running (nearly 20 years) forum on her website, but the activity slowly diminished as everybody went to FB and Twitter. She actually commented on the site occasionally, which made it kind of unique, I suppose. But almost at the same time I "discovered" Sarah her forum went offline, and that was it. I don't do FB, so I was "left in the cold". Sarah rescued me! That wasn't the reason, it was coincidental, but lacking that forum sort of sent me looking for a replacement. There was a lot of social activity that went with it, like there is here. I was really pleased to find this site, and Ellen's resources helped deepen my appreciation for Sarah's music. It is great to see people from all over the world involved with it, too, like Carol is. So Full Speed Ahead, Ellen!